I know it’s not healthy, but I’m putting my latest comment response to the resident Christian fundie in another blogpost. His post in full is here.
Wow James, nice rant. Sorry to have to debunk it.
David, don’t ever apologise for the entertainment you provide while doing whatever you think “debunking” means.
Homosexual sex is not natural for humans.
We’re having this discussion across computer terminals thousands of miles apart, converting our thoughts and opinions into a flow of electrons and decoding them again into words, through technological methods the workings of which neither of us has to understand. I’m doing this while wearing polyester and drinking numerous carbonated E-numbers. None of this is natural.
And it’s not normal either.
I’m not sure what you mean by that, but one interpretation is simply that most people aren’t gay and have no compulsion to engage in homosexual acts. This may be true, but would the morality of it change, then, if it became a majority position? Most people don’t like anchovies on their pizza, and very few people seemed to enjoy watching the film Norbit. Are these immoral acts too?
And it is against the laws of God…
Regarding the reasons why homosexuality is wrong, it is always because God says so.
Obviously I dispute that this is true – but even if it was, this isn’t morality, this is an entirely distinct thing with a different name. It’s called “doing what you’re told”. If things are moral because God instructs them, and that’s all there is to it, then that’s an uninteresting definition of “moral”. Stoning children to death has been in line with the laws of God in the past, but I will call that immoral regardless of how powerful a despot ordered it. I don’t care to be a slave to your deity if he can’t justify his oppression.
I personally do not care what you do in private. That’s your business. But don’t expect that you can shove it down my throat and get me to like it. And don’t ask for my approval, or consent.
You clearly do care what people do in private, otherwise we wouldn’t be having this discussion. You’re telling people at length that what they do in private is immoral and against God’s law. Nobody’s shoving anything down your throat, and nobody needs or is asking for your approval or consent for anything that’s none of your damn business. You’re making judgments on other people’s personal feelings and private actions. You’re claiming things to be inherently immoral and against God’s law. If this isn’t sticking your nose into other people’s business, I cannot conceive what is.
I believe the Bible is literally the word of God, absolutely. That doesn’t mean that it’s a science manual. There’s no science in the Bible.
The Bible might not read like a science textbook, but it makes factual claims about reality, and thus science has every right to comment on its accuracy. It doesn’t matter if it doesn’t call itself science; it’s saying things about the world, which can be supported or rejected based on evidence. If the Bible claims that the Universe was created over the course of one week around six thousand years ago, science can say: “Well, based on reams of data gathered from numerous different fields, there is literally nothing outside of this book which indicates that this is true.”
The Darwin position claims that a thing developed due to random forces alone.
It’s very clear that you don’t understand what Darwin said or what the modern theory of evolution proposes. It doesn’t just all happen randomly, as has been explained to thousands of creationists all over the internet many, many times before by people who actually know what they’re talking about. Non-random selection processes are key to evolutionary theory, as Darwin well understood. You really have to be wilfully ignoring information to still not understand this.
Darwin was wrong because he eliminated any possibilty of God.
I have no idea how you fathom that Darwin “eliminated any possibilty of God”. How would anyone even do that? The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins doesn’t even do that, or claim to. This is just weird.
Darwin changed the scientific method to allow for his hypothesis in absence of any physical proof.
You still haven’t explained what it means to say that Darwin “changed the scientific method”. He laid out the evidence that had led him to his conclusion; the evolutionary model explains past observations and predicts future ones more succinctly and reliably than any other theory. This is just what science is.
Regarding your idiot comment about priests, it’s working remarkably well. Some who felt called to priesthood, obviously weren’t.
Who gets to decide who’s really called to the priesthood? Is it you, David? You should go and tell these people who mistakenly think they’ve been called, and let them know how wrong they are before they make a horrible mistake. You probably know what they’re feeling better than they do, after all. While you’re at it, you should probably have a word with all those people who’ve been “called” to celibacy but who don’t recognise it, and think they’re just experiencing same-sex attraction. It’s important they understand the difference.
As for God, he’s asking (not demanding-you have free will, his gift) you to surrender to him, because he can. Government commands taxes because it can, even if it doesn’t give much of it back to you. You have to pay.
So, you seem to be entirely on board with your god being an oppressive tyrant, punishing us puny humans for not doing what he wants simply because he’s the one with the power. I don’t even care if he exists any more. He’s not worth worshipping. He doesn’t deserve it.
If God didn’t want us to be happy, why did he make sex pleasureable, and give us minds to create art, good food and wine, and music?
If God does want us to be happy, why doesn’t he try not giving children cancer? Or helping out the millions of starving Africans whose situation is entirely unjust? How are tsunamis that destroy cities and leave millions homeless to be used “the right way”? And if God didn’t want anyone to indulge in homosexuality, why did he make that so pleasurable? Find any gay person who’s accepted who they are instead of trying to repress it, and ask them if they enjoy sex.
As for why God allowed 9/11, I’ll ask Him when I see him. You’ll know, too.
It’s disturbing how eager you are to just take God’s word for it that it all works out somehow, and ask him when you see him. Nothing about the current set-up of the world gives you any reason to doubt what you’ve been told about his divine plans. Any compassion for millions of suffering humans is quelled by the insistence that this is how it’s supposed to be. God is good, and he wants us all to be happy.
Again, rationalisation of a blind ideology at its most evil.